Gillmor Gang Live Friday 01.09.15 LIVE recording at 1pm PT/4pm ET http://ustream.tv/GillmorGang
Laura Norvig,
J.C. Bouvier,
Nir Ben Yona,
Dale Lature,
clive boulton,
and
Punty Prendergast
liked this
room for me today?
- Kevin Marks
the hell with this errands, I'm going to listen in!
- Darius Dunlap
Here
- Keith Teare
I also posted it at http://www.kevinmarks.com/newclue...
- Kevin Marks
It always starts like this...
- Doc
Hey, Doc. Big week for you! Congrats on New Clues!
- Tom Guarriello
Thanks. Congrat @dweinberger as well
- Doc
Of course!
- Tom Guarriello
Is anything on ustream yet? I'm guessing not, but don't wanna check and hose the connection.
- Doc
Test pattern and now sound
- Tom Guarriello
There they are...
- Darius Dunlap
Hey David and Doc looking forward to this today
- Dale Lature
oops. back to test pattern
- Darius Dunlap
Is Zuckerberg watching!
- clive boulton
Clive: He's busy reading not watching!
- Alex de Soto
I'd rather know what Doc and David are reading
- clive boulton
Hey David!
- Tom Guarriello
Blues Clues
- Kevin Marks
Yes
- Tom Guarriello
Yep. and tweeted it!
- Darius Dunlap
I've read it. And Dave Winer's Listicle
- Francine Hardaway
there now, dig that header graphic
- Jerome Hughes
Hey everybody! Happy new years!
- Chris Hale
Cat Herding should be mentioned, for sure!
- Tom Guarriello
Too much living in the past. I'm out.
- Thomas Rector
TGIF people.
- J.C. Bouvier
hey Y'all!
- Tina Chase Gillmor
I do remind folks that the Web is not just what Google indexes.
- Alex de Soto
good to see you all here in 2015!
- Tina Chase Gillmor
HNY, Tina
- Tom Guarriello
thx Tom
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Apps vs. Net comin up
- Tom Guarriello
Doc if you could tilt up just a tad. great. you over corrected.
- Tina Chase Gillmor
other way
- Tina Chase Gillmor
The four big boys Google, Apple, Facebook, and Amazon (or GAFA)
- clive boulton
great thx Doc
- Tina Chase Gillmor
I have the laptop in a drawer to make the background work.
- Doc
Why aren't we talking about CES ? So much stuff came out this week
- Chris Hale
Apps to me are what makes the web alot more powerful and contextual
- Chris Hale
Chris - we will round up CES next week.
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Connectivity v. Silos seems like the theme
- Tom Guarriello
oh gotcha. But wont all the stuff from ces already be obsolete? Hehe. This industry moves too fast sometimes
- Chris Hale
Internet needs a few more open protocols
- Chris Hale
plague of auto-play ads that stall and don't stream right are the worst ever.
- clive boulton
especially for video and audio
- Chris Hale
ChatCenter is http and URLs
- Keith Teare
Advertising needs a new way of thinking on Mobile
- Moe Glitz
Yahoo might remake advertising buy CNN and flow ads from mobile to TV?
- clive boulton
I agree Moe.
- Chris Hale
i think beacons will change a lot of that. I worry advertisers and companies will ruin a perfectly cool technology
- Chris Hale
darn, i missed Keith hitting himself
- Tina Chase Gillmor
scroll to the bottom of http://www.kevinmarks.com/newclue... and see the interactions
- Kevin Marks
Apps simplify the web
- Moe Glitz
I just fell off
- Kevin Marks
call me bac
- Kevin Marks
ill call you back
- Tina Chase Gillmor
there you are
- Tina Chase Gillmor
no video
- Kevin Marks
in some ways, yes it simplifies the web but it i think the point Steve G keeps making about the importance of notifications as part of that simplification is starting to get seriously cluttered.
- Chris Hale
App bubble in the tech economy about to shrink or burst?
- christina sponselli
Apple app designers currently having robust debate about economics of today's app world
- Tom Guarriello
did yall hear that figure that just came out that the IOS app store clears like 500k a week worldwide?
- Chris Hale
Interesting that the clues harp on apps and ads but don't have anything to say about "public relations"
- Frank Paynter
Yes, some apps also support those Values... Think reading and sharing apps that allow various workflows for bookmarking, organizing, research, writing, thinking....
- Darius Dunlap
Brands need to stop advertising to Consumers and engage with us more on mobile. If they do that then they will get our name, our payment details and our chat walls
- Moe Glitz
Steve, i tweeted you a link to a picture of the Cluetrain Books- the original and the 10th anniversary update
- Dale Lature
Frank, we hoped that jpeople could take the too many clues, and run off and add their own. We actually took on PR pretty bluntly in Cluetrain the book. Didn't want to repeat ourselves.
- Doc
2015 iOS based Macbook coming -- (a definite maybe) -- no App bubble!
- clive boulton
i think the problem is that technology can do some scary stuff and there is very little governance about limits to how advertisers should use data they have collected. I think don't be creepy never enters advertisers minds. They really need to think about this stuff more
- Chris Hale
Maybe the app bubble is apps available only in company stores.
- Doc
Beacons
- Moe Glitz
cat pulled my headphones out
- Kevin Marks
1:30 in Santa Barbara is leaf blowing time. Damn. So noisy...
- Doc
+1 Doc. Salesforce apps!
- clive boulton
Cats taking over the internet.
- Alex de Soto
minimum viable centralization (nice one Doc)
- clive boulton
centralization problem, it sucks all the profits from the edges and connections (music industry)
- clive boulton
That was Brian Behlendorf's line, clive. Credit where due.
- Doc
homphily, that's called. Ethan Zuckerman's Rewire book.
- Doc
Is Steve still here?
- Doc
Steve's been disappeared...
- Tom Guarriello
The next mobile app that can create the best Brand Experience between Consumers & Businesses. Will become the next pillar of Social Media beside Facebook & Twitter for Brands
- Moe Glitz
Everybody is now this guy: http://www.acceler8or.com/tags...
- Doc
Brian Behlendorf's MVC line concise business plan for startup
- clive boulton
All the stuff hanging off that guy is on your phone now.
- Doc
May even be featured on Brands labels
- Moe Glitz
hm. the version I reposted still hase the evil inclinations bit http://www.kevinmarks.com/newclue....
- Kevin Marks
This is not an all-happy wall: http://www.truste.com/us-cons...
- Doc
i really feel like i wish more stuff on phones was centralized
- Chris Hale
the problem I have with RSS isn't the web
- Kevin Marks
like, i have 6 apps to run all the automation devices for my apartment
- Chris Hale
not good for simple home automation
- Chris Hale
and id still love one app that i use for any text based communication with people
- Chris Hale
since now there seems to be 50 ways to contact people, sms, tweet, fb , google+, whatsapp, yo, and too many more
- Chris Hale
Chewing the fats
- Moe Glitz
people navigate those deliberately though
- Kevin Marks
deep linking is good but not a cure for this problem
- Chris Hale
Apps are the new TV
- Moe Glitz
Growth at firms like Salesforce will peter out w/o decentralizing SaaS. Mobile apps case in point.
- clive boulton
i know Kevin,but from an efficiency and overal user experience it is kinda sucky
- Chris Hale
Chris Hale - Tantek has an interesting concept, the contact page as an app... http://tantek.com/contact.html
- Darius Dunlap
the silos don't want you to interoperate though
- Kevin Marks
there was a point where they were all using xmpp, but they forked
- Kevin Marks
Like TV
- Moe Glitz
yes darius
- Kevin Marks
+1 david!
- Doc
yeah Kevin. I hear ya. I have been considering building my own app this whole thing irks me that much. Thats part of why i built my own home automation framework. Everyone elses system has a lot of gaps
- Chris Hale
silos need incentives to interoperate (Judy's built Epic Systems EHR profits on silos)
- clive boulton
Thank you Steve! Authoring today is easier for the average human being!
- Simon Benvenutto
I do wish folks wouldn't perpetrate the idea the GoDaddy crap sandwich is inevitable. Support and promote Hover.com and other good vendors.
- Darius Dunlap
do you think people want more apps or less apps?
- Chris Hale
More Chris
- Moe Glitz
are we still on the air?
- Doc
can you hera us?
- Kevin Marks
They don't search on Mobile
- Moe Glitz
Not here
- Tom Guarriello
i am middle of the road. Sometimes i get frustrated when i look at my app screen and see apps. I find myself having to use spotlight search on my iphone almost all the time to find a particular app
- Chris Hale
oops. feed down
- Darius Dunlap
Down in London
- Moe Glitz
Steve just cut out in UK
- Simon Benvenutto
are we dark on the 'cast?
- Doc
hang on, the tricaster crashed
- Kevin Marks
rebooting
- Kevin Marks
Steve is rebooting us.
- Doc
Yep, Chris. likewise here...
- Darius Dunlap
But the best apps really do provide a better workflow and experience.
- Darius Dunlap
aha. I finally figured out how to get on the backchannel. I want a badge.
- david weinberger
Especially for those of us who want to do more than read and listen.
- Darius Dunlap
Will iOS Macbook take us further down the rabbit hole...
- clive boulton
Steve thinks we're 90 secs away from reboot
- david weinberger
+1 david
- Alex de Soto
no such thing, Clive.
- Darius Dunlap
Meanwhile, Doc seems to have invited a leafblower into his living room
- david weinberger
It's the sponsor's fault...
- Doc
Welcome to the REAL Gillmor Gang, David
- Tom Guarriello
The five of us are taking the opportunity to swig some cheap bourbon
- david weinberger
ARe we back?
- Doc
I never thought the web was particularly democratic: it is server centric, you always surf alone, you need an IP, HTML skills, etc. Nowhere near as democratic as a free, open, P2P medium such as CB radio :) that's yet to be realised, on a global scale.
- Simon Benvenutto
We seem to be up on ustream. No?
- david weinberger
But an iPad, especially when outfitted with a keyboard (because I'm an old guy who types fast) is a really useful tool.
- Darius Dunlap
refresh ustream to see us
- Kevin Marks
Video no audio
- Tom Guarriello
Not yet, Darius - Apple keeps back fitting iOS features to OS X...
- clive boulton
Steve, we lost you when you were commenting about Facebook and video.
- christina sponselli
yes
- Keith Teare
steve is initializing tricaster. a few more secs
- david weinberger
no volume
- clive boulton
Still no audio here
- Tom Guarriello
no audio for me
- Graham Zulauf
working on the vid
- david weinberger
can you hear us?
- david weinberger
Yep, no audio here, either
- Darius Dunlap
an you see us?
- david weinberger
Tommy?
- david weinberger
Yep
- Darius Dunlap
yes
- Dale Lature
yes
- clive boulton
(old man reference)
- david weinberger
Audio is back
- Alex de Soto
Sound back!
- Simon Benvenutto
how about video?
- david weinberger
Yes...it's Pink Floyd...
- Tom Guarriello
audio is back for me
- Graham Zulauf
we hear you
- clive boulton
video is working
- Graham Zulauf
Steve=Pinball Wizard?
- christina sponselli
Yep, Clive. But that's a long way from "iOS Mac". They're not dumbing down the mac, but bringing some really useful integration to the workflow of multiple devices.
- Darius Dunlap
ah ha, you're still there!
- Laura Norvig
So weird. We've NEVER had the Tricaster fail like that. It wasn't our power.
- Tina Chase Gillmor
and some more levels of control via app store in Mac OS X
- david weinberger
email, and even newsgroups... :-)
- Darius Dunlap
I just love the way Kevin says "Twitter". ;-)
- Tina Chase Gillmor
There's too many Apps on iOS and Android for someone to ignore bringing apps to the desktop.
- clive boulton
Totally agree with Kevin... Ev does a nice job taking about some of this in his recent post.
- Darius Dunlap
As long as their friends are there.
- christina sponselli
I agree the app stores and the web in general are becoming very nanny state, its less about communicating and more about transacting, which is sad... that's the price we are paying for great cheap infrastructure, compared to 15 years ago.
- Simon Benvenutto
Well said, Keith
- Tom Guarriello
+1 david weinberger "some more levels of control via app store in Mac OS X"
- clive boulton
Yep, Simon and David... agree about App Stores. They (especially Apple) need to think deeply about what they are for and how they should work for users.
- Darius Dunlap
That flavor of idealism is hard to imagine amongst human beings, Keith
- Tom Guarriello
Tom - I'm still hoping :-)
- Keith Teare
And, I applaud you for it, K
- Tom Guarriello
Missing from enterprise is some way to orchestrate apps into a suite collection on/off the desktop
- clive boulton
slack does that to some extent
- Kevin Marks
Aren't we dependent on the control of ISPs anyway?
- Alex de Soto
looking at slack - thx Kevin
- clive boulton
Human beings are imperfect. But the New Clues remind people who weren't there at the beginning that there WAS a philosophy
- Francine Hardaway
A lot of it has to do with being right.
- Darius Dunlap
Dave's listicle was easier to read.
- Francine Hardaway
Thanks, francine
- david weinberger
I shared it with people who said tl;dr
- Kevin Marks
+1 Francine
- Tom Guarriello
It's related to Powerpoint
- Francine Hardaway
yep, like the listicle
- Laura Norvig
+1 on the philosophy, not specifically the listicle
- Tom Guarriello
Dave's a talented guy. I just wished he worked and played well with others
- Francine Hardaway
It makes the Cluetrain a franchise, like Terminator
- Francine Hardaway
Or, Hunger Games!
- Tom Guarriello
They're baaaaaack!
- Tina Chase Gillmor
chrome team is working at bringing Android Apps to chromebook. Apple / MSFT can't ignore.
- clive boulton
Lovely irony
- Darius Dunlap
That's small m vs. Medium
- Tom Guarriello
One could compete with Medium with Large.
- Doc
I LOVE Medium. But I've always been a Ev product fan
- Francine Hardaway
“Live the values you want the Internet to promote.” http://www.kevinmarks.com/newclue....
- Kevin Marks
Is that like being the change you'd like to see?
- Francine Hardaway
I made it look worse http://www.kevinmarks.com/newclue...
- Kevin Marks
:D
- Kevin Marks
That's one of my favorites, too, Kevin. That's the Gandhi Clue
- Tom Guarriello
Still prefer tumblr to medium
- clive boulton
Don't leave any ice picks around, Keith.
- Doc
Keith Teare: Venture Trotskyist
- Kevin Marks
Did you get approval on piece before Medium published it?
- christina sponselli
Keith is way left
- Tina Chase Gillmor
when Keith says "can I pick your brain", watch out
- Kevin Marks
It's always a question of size ;-)
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Heyo! Trotsky jokes, amirite?
- david weinberger
Trotsky was "picked" he never did the "picking" :-)
- Keith Teare
+1 for Kevin's Venture trotskyite
- david weinberger
Oh crap, we're all gonna die
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Fuck those yellow spores! Hooyah!
- david weinberger
I told you: Hunger Games!!!
- Tom Guarriello
Medium too trendy already. Used to be cool ...
- Laura Norvig
If I bring a smile to Doc's lips ikt's all been worthwhile
- david weinberger
Doc's right. It keeps moving
- Francine Hardaway
Medium: nobody goes there anymore...it's too crowded
- Tom Guarriello
I agree with Doc, and I'm hopeful, but in human society there are always those looking to profit from manipulating the system.
- Darius Dunlap
It's not about apps. It's about open vs. closed.
- david weinberger
And individual vs. copllaborative
- david weinberger
And consume vs create
- david weinberger
An app world that did that would be fine
- david weinberger
It's closed that doesn't survive. THat's why the companies fall
- Francine Hardaway
I thought Medium is how you deal with site-deaths.
- Todd Hoff
I want an app that eats itself and leaves crumbs on my screen.
- Doc
My favorite apps are all about that, David. And they are mostly on Mac and iOS.
- Darius Dunlap
Apps are a red herring that the New Clues raise -- but it's a herring that stands fsor an important school o fish
- david weinberger
are there apps that are open that aren't just glorified web interfaces ...?
- Laura Norvig
Yep, David.
- Darius Dunlap
Back we go to notifications
- Francine Hardaway
+ 1 Keith. iOS back-fitted to OS X and swallows apps (or makes apps available on desktop)
- clive boulton
Yeah, Dudes. What about notifications?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Clue 125: Notifications are Conversations
- Doc
"Companies make a religion of security, but this is largely a giant red herring. Do you know how tough it is to worship a giant red herring?" - Gluetrain
- Kevin Marks
Cool addition, Doc
- Tom Guarriello
it's being managed by Scarlett Johansen. duh.
- Laura Norvig
Clue 126: No, wait, conversations are notifications.
- david weinberger
The Gluetrain was fun. We need him back for New Clues.
- Doc
Steve has enterprise instincts.
- clive boulton
"Markets are money." - Gluetrain (I think)
- Doc
Actually, David, that's traditionally more true
- Francine Hardaway
+1 Gluetrain. We need New Glues
- david weinberger
Tina, I have to drop off at 2.35
- Keith Teare
Keith, you've got 10 minutes
- Francine Hardaway
Gluetrain is excellent!
- Tom Guarriello
Steve it's 2:23.... We're probably at 1:18 of actual show
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Glad David is expanding on this... "App" as a proxy for something bigger
- Darius Dunlap
Kevin's train of thought, snowballs for open source enterprise apps
- clive boulton
Are we ahead?
- Francine Hardaway
Have a great weekend all!
- J.C. Bouvier
Good point, Francine. I think so. The clues are in the apps...
- clive boulton
Next time, David, we talk Heidegger!
- Tom Guarriello
Clue #127: Are you the armadillo or are you the bike?
- david weinberger
Clue 128: What??
- david weinberger
you just daleked out for me
- Kevin Marks
What happened to the housekeeping?
- Francine Hardaway
Name this show: Venture Trotskyist's
- clive boulton
Can you still hear us?
- david weinberger
no
- Francine Hardaway
nope, feed is dead
- Darius Dunlap
great show.......hanging on every word.......thanks Doc and Dave, and Keith, Steve, and Kevin....great conversations
- Dale Lature
+1 "Can you still hear us?
- clive boulton
the backchannel lives.
- Doc
I really think GG should have an "AfterDark", at least for the live listeners. ;-)
- Darius Dunlap
Unfortunately, I've got to run. Ciao, all!
- Darius Dunlap
There's usually a brief check-in with the faces on the show before turning it off. That went fast this time.
- Doc
Sorry I joined thischat so late.
- david weinberger
Okay, I need to disassemble this rig on a drawer and move the laptop. Been great, everybody.
- Doc
But thanks for it.
- david weinberger
Apparently I have to clean up my office.
- david weinberger
So long.
- david weinberger
bye chaps
- Kevin Marks
bye
- Doc