Gillmor Gang recording live 1PM Pacific ht

Should be a good show. Craig Burton always has something interesting to say. - Cliff Gerrish

Waiting for call. - Robert Scoble

Looking forward to the show. - Matt M (inactive)

A fellow Utahn - I will be watching :-) - Jesse Stay

hmmm. silverlight plugin just went kerfluey on me...let's see if it works now. - Karoli

Still waiting for skype call... - Robert Scoble

Looks like we're very close to start. - Robert Scoble

ah..working now. - Karoli

Chris Messina is on too. - Robert Scoble

Yay Phil and Craig! Two of my favorite Utahns - Jesse Stay

Robert's pretty close to having a "lair" there... - Ken Sheppardson

LIve from @ribbit http://bit.ly/Spawn on Gillmor Gang - Kevin Marks

robert, i can't imagine going from that to an iphone. your head must explode daily. - Karoli

Twitter.com FTW! - Jesse Stay

Actually, I use e-mail for most of my Twitter activity - Jesse Stay

Robert's head exploding is all part of the show. - Cliff Gerrish

You guys should be sure to talk about the new Paypal identity proposals - Jesse Stay

Karoli: info density is pretty crazy! Jesse: I got some good interviews on that yesterday. Should be up on Building43 next week. - Robert Scoble

where are they again? - Christopher Harris

Phil and Chris are at http://www.internetidentityworkshop.com - Ken Sheppardson

thx - Christopher Harris

I love how all the Identity pieces are fitting together now with OpenID+OAuth Hybrid, WebFinger and XRD and Activity Streams and PoCo at #iiw this week - Kevin Marks

IIW was great this year. - Cliff Gerrish

Robert, I'm getting more info on it as well - they want to be much more open than it appeared in the keynote - Jesse Stay

Jesse: I will try to introduce PayPal's identity moves into this conversation. Also, what @marcglasberg http://icents.net is doing to turn Twitter into a micropayments system for content. - Robert Scoble

Robert, missed what @marcglasberg is doing - can't wait to hear more - Jesse Stay

Someone tell Craig to turn the sounds off on his TweetDeck ;-) - Jesse Stay

and tell them I said hi from the chat (I don't think they're watching this) - Jesse Stay

"Open ID threat level Orange?" - Rob La Gesse

OpenID is just putting on long pants, a shirt and a tie. - Cliff Gerrish

says @chrismessina the Govt is encouraging people to use OpenID as most people have them already. - Kevin Marks

Badfinger or Webfinger? - Cliff Gerrish

Email seems like a bad identifier. - Cliff Gerrish

http://webfinger.org - it is a protocol to map an emial address into an OpenID endpoint - works with gmail and yahoo already - Kevin Marks

Just ran into this on stackoverflow.com... they have logos for 10 different OpenID providers or your own URL and I think I have IDs on 8 of them... and I have no idea which one I used to create my account. - Ken Sheppardson

The right number of id providers is 1. Selectors can solve this problem. - Cliff Gerrish

We should be able to "transform" emails to OpenID, as described here: http://chrissaad.wordpress.com/2008... (see comments) - Panayotis Vryonis

Hey Kevin how do I get involved in what you guys are doing with OpenID? - Jesse Stay

Jesse, come to the next IIW. - Cliff Gerrish

It would be great if Twitter supported OpenID as well as OAuth #iiw - Kevin Marks

Watching the show but the FF stream is "frozen" from last week?just me? - Paul Sherer

Twitter as an OpenID provider? - Ken Sheppardson

Cliff, I wasn't aware of it - that would have been interesting. I was just out there the last 3 days at the Paypal conference. - Jesse Stay

Paul, refresh. The thread has been updated inside NewsGang. - Cliff Gerrish

Wow - I didn't realize Paypal was part of the OpenID foundation - Jesse Stay

@Paul - working fine here. Are you at http://www.building43.com/realtim... ? - Rob La Gesse

I don't quite understand why we need Salmon independent of Activitystrea.ms. Seems like a "feature" of activitystreams. - Ken Sheppardson

I'll head over to building34, thanks. - Paul Sherer

Monica's Activity Streams prezi: http://prezi.com/yxvtypx-aani/ maps out the ideas behind it too - Kevin Marks

Calling out "comment streams" as some special case of activities seems like a dead end. - Ken Sheppardson

Ken, Salmon is just the part that shows how to send the comments upstream, it fits in with Activity Streams fine. - Kevin Marks

Of course in FF the comment thread can appear in multiple places simultaneously via iframe. - Cliff Gerrish

So, Kevin, can Salmon support any Activitystreams objects? ... Got it. - Ken Sheppardson

Salmon I'm Atom... I'm getting lost here - Frank Paynter

Cool, I'm totally going to rip off the salmon idea and make my own proprietary protocol. - Vezquex

do you need an iFrog to use ribbit? - Frank Paynter

Okay - I missed the last 15 mins. Did I miss anything? - Jesse Stay

If Gillmor Gang watchers want Ribbit Mobile, got to http://ribbit.com/reserve.php and use the invite code 'gang09' - Kevin Marks

Is Messina on the Space Station? - Jesse Newhart

I wish somebody would put together some sort of over-arching reference document that explains how you build something that uses PSHB, OpenID, OAuth, Salmon, Activitystreams, etc in the "correct" way in an integrated system. - Ken Sheppardson

Ken, check out the identity commons. - Cliff Gerrish

I really wish Phil and Craig were in here. I need to get those guys together for lunch some time. That would be a fun meeting. - Jesse Stay

I think you can catch both Phil and Craig at the Kynetx conference. It's coming right up. - Cliff Gerrish

Conference de jour, literally ;-) Can't we all just agree to get together once a year or so in one place and deal with everything at once? :-) - Ken Sheppardson

how about adding lists to lists? when's that coming? - Frank Paynter

Ken, that's what the weekly Gillmor Gang is for. Everyone in one place in real time. - Cliff Gerrish

I love how Atom is so flexible that we can add all these extra layers on top of it. ActivityStreams, Salmon, PSHB, etc - Matt M (inactive)

YES. filters to something manageable. - Karoli

frank, isn't that what listorious is for? :) - Karoli

Cliff: It's just that all these conference give me the apparently mistaken impression that there are more than 10 or so folks who I really have to follow ;-) - Ken Sheppardson

Karoli... mebbe, but I'm a fan of bundling functionality within the native platform - Frank Paynter

Seems like building a bunch of translators is the best way to get adoption. - Cliff Gerrish

Isn't that what Gnip's supposed to be doing? - Ken Sheppardson

Facebook just needs to remove the 24 hour storage limit and it will be free - Jesse Stay

@cgerrish yes, translators into Activity Streams rather than n by n translators is an important saving - Kevin Marks

Cliff, yeah - I'll be at the Kynetx conference - Jesse Stay

I see Phil all the time - haven't met Craig yet (except online) - Jesse Stay

Amen Mark - more clients need to support activitystrea.ms - Jesse Stay

Myspace is still very much in the game - Jesse Stay

Wait and see - there are some huge things coming to Myspace - Jesse Stay

So we're all going to speak activitystreams on the global back-end bus and all these sites just become "clients"? Cool. I'm down with that. - Ken Sheppardson

Ken, all but Twitter, at least the way they're going - Jesse Stay

MySpace need a major shift to survive - Rocky Barbanica

Rocky, keep watching. - Jesse Stay

But if *everything* else is connected, we can all just pool our API call limits to pull the full feed out of Twitter and translate it to AS - Ken Sheppardson

Go tell @loic to support Activity Streams from MySpace and Netflix, @scobleizer - Kevin Marks

That's the theory, Ken. At least until the next time something closed and exciting comes along, ;) - Matt M (inactive)

It will be everyone supports open standards, then you'll also have to support Twitter's own standard - at least if you ask John at Twitter - Jesse Stay

JK's sane, Jesse... if this all got widespread adoption I think you'd see a different bottom-up attitude from Twitter... - Ken Sheppardson

The custom adapters actually creates a value proposition. - Cliff Gerrish

http://cliqset.com is an Activity Streams supporting aggregator, as is MS Live - Kevin Marks

Facebook needs public indexing to get legit... they can't because of privacy aspect of their service... FriendFeed can provide the opening to public indexing of Facebook users' wall content... - Frank Paynter

Ken, yeah - I just don't like his attitude around it - Jesse Stay

anything but FB, please. - Karoli

Frank, you can use FQL to search Facebook pretty much site-wide (at least as privacy allows) - Jesse Stay

I can sorta see Twitter's point... I mean Evan came to them a year ago and said "Hey, you should support OMB" and their natural response as "Uh... no.... why? Nobody's using it..." - Ken Sheppardson

I should note Twitter doesn't allow specific queries like FQL btw - Jesse Stay

I'd just as soon not search Facebook. or even use it. - Karoli

Jesse...yahbut, you can't find Facebook content on google - Frank Paynter

@Frank - yet! - Rob La Gesse

Frank, yes you can - Jesse Stay

There's a strong current of relevant discussion on Facebook that is hard for me to ignore - Frank Paynter

If Activitystreams was implemented widely, I suspect the engineers at Twitter would warm up to it. That might not be a sufficient condition, but it's certainly necessary. - Ken Sheppardson

sad that no-one from @twitterapi came to IIW this year; @blaine came + helped invent OAuth when they were 1/10th the size - Kevin Marks

Frank: http://www.google.com/search... - Jesse Stay

Facebook encourages self-censorship, or disownership, depending. (Basically I don't really want my Republican spouse reading my liberal rants) - Karoli

@Kevin - they are busy building lists. - Rob La Gesse

Kevin, yeah - that's been my perception - they're taking no part in any of the open efforts, which concerns me - Jesse Stay

I think we all scared them off at BearHugCamp last fall ;-) - Ken Sheppardson

Kevin, is Facebook there at all? I imagine Recordon's probably there? - Jesse Stay

That's consistent with what Bret said last week, RE Facebook - Ken Sheppardson

hubs will be distributed. facebook will lose their advantage. - scott anderson

scott, i think so too. Google federating wave is one step closer to that... - Karoli

perfect question - Rocky Barbanica

Where's Microsoft in all this, btw? - Ken Sheppardson

MSFT had a big presence at IIW - Information cards (selectors) started with them. - Cliff Gerrish

Here's another good Google search on Facebook: site:www.facebook.com lists - status updates will very soon also be part of that - Jesse Stay

What did Scoble just call his wife? - Cliff Gerrish

As soon as grandmas start using a service, Robert bails... so... y'know... ;-) - Ken Sheppardson

Scott, Facebook is becoming distributed - Jesse Stay

Jesse... thanks for the "site: facebook" clue, but it's weak... I've just been testing it and nothing relevant emerged in response to specific search requests - Frank Paynter

Ken - MS is busy building layoff packages and not serious software. - Rob La Gesse

MSFT had a lot of good people at #iiw, and they are really contributing to the Activity Streams and OWF efforts - Kevin Marks

@KevinMarks. Thanks for the mention. Yes, we (Cliqset) currently normalize activity from 70+ services into activity streams compliant atom feeds. We also share them in real-time through our APIs. - Darren

Frank, a lot of cool articles about Twitter lists - I thought it was interesting "site:facebook.com lists" - Jesse Stay

Save the demo for a building43 video :) - Rob La Gesse

Frank, status updates are also very soon going to be included in that as well. Very soon you'll see those come up in search results. - Jesse Stay

We will, Rob - Rocky Barbanica

Seeing individual engineers and marketing folks from MSFT at different events reminds me alot of my old NASA days, when you'd always find some sort of "rogue" engineer off working on pretty much any project you can imagine. Every once in a while all the "rogue" engineers from the different centers who were working on similar projects would get together... but they were rarely funded and projects never went anywhere. But on the flip side... I'm glad they're involved :-) - Ken Sheppardson

Scoble is such a non-programmer. Everything he says that's hard sounds easy. "How do I bundle 3 tweets?" Just use take their URIs or copy the text. - Vezquex

Interesting show. - Rob La Gesse

Thanks for the info Jesse - Frank Paynter

Oh man... - Rocky Barbanica

thanks, steve - Karoli

Vezquex: sorry, that just does NOT do it for me. - Robert Scoble

what more do you need? - Vezquex

Vezquex: I want to put them on a page and have them look like Tweets, mixed with YouTUbe videos, mixed with photos. Make it freaking easy. Copy and pasting and doing screen captures is NOT easy for most people. - Robert Scoble

Did they mention the Paypal identification proposal at all? I think I missed it. - Jesse Stay

Just in passing, Jesse - Ken Sheppardson

We never got to it Jesse - Craig Burton

Ken, I'm very fascinated by that, because it's true identity. If they can make that open along with the existing open standards around identity they're going to do some great things. I'm supposed to get a briefing by them soon (I hope). - Jesse Stay

Vezquex: look at the Tweets I put into Wordpress: http://scobleizer.com/2009... that took a LOT of work. Way too much for normal people and WAY too much for real-time work. Did you watch the World Series last night? MSNBC had a Tweet out AS THE BALL HIT THE GLOVE TO END THE GAME! - Robert Scoble

Craig, great seeing you, btw! I don't think we've ever met in person. - Jesse Stay

This is a real time world and copying and pasting URLs is too freaking hard. - Robert Scoble

Thanks Jesse, we need to make that happen. - Craig Burton

Plus, I do everything on my iPhone now. Did you remember how we broke the news of Facebook buying FriendFeed? That entire thing was done from an iPhone, including an audio interview. - Robert Scoble

Craig, just sent you and Phil an e-mail. Let's definitely make it happen. - Jesse Stay

Paypal is still very weak. They are not quite clued in to the selector imperative. - Craig Burton

Jesse: applications running on the open web will always be able to innovate and provide more functionality than apps running on top of Facebook. With activity streams, hubs, openid, etc. the reduced friction advantage that Facebook has is diminished. - scott anderson

Craig, that's my worry - Jesse Stay

Scott, Facebook is joining the open web - Jesse Stay

it's all talk until it happens - scott anderson

they also said Beacon was going to be revolutionary - scott anderson

Facebook is an activitystrea.ms provider right now: http://wiki.developers.facebook.com/index.... They are also currently an openid provider. - Jesse Stay

Facebook has openID? - Matt M (inactive)

I think you see it now with the work Recordon and the ex-FriendFeeders are doing... but the IP limits, 24hr cache limits, and EULA mythology seems to cast a shadow over everything - Ken Sheppardson

Also see: http://wiki.developers.facebook.com/index... - Jesse Stay

and http://developers.facebook.com/opensou... - Jesse Stay

openid support is defensive move - scott anderson

BTW, most this stuff was around even before Recordon came on board - Jesse Stay

Yeah, I realized that after I wrote that, Jesse... he's just sorta the flag bearer these days - Ken Sheppardson

Scott, they've had that support for at least 6 months now - Jesse Stay

Facebook led much of the activitystrea.ms standard - it is not a defensive move. They were part of the organization, and are also members of the openid foundation. They're leaders in this, not followers. - Jesse Stay

openid support is a defensive move because they don't want google to dominate the openid space. if activity stream content expires after some period of time when it leaves Facebook, then that is another defensive move and one that is not truly open. - scott anderson

Scott, I'm not sure they've said much about that content expiring. As long as you're a user I'm pretty sure you're able to get your content out, no exceptions. Developers have a few more strict rules, but nothing's stopping a client from enabling that for users themselves. The RSS News Feed app on Facebook's still around, so I think they're opening up to enabling that: http://www.facebook.com/apps... - Jesse Stay

Also, see Facebook's latest news - their entire JS client library is now open source on GitHub: http://bit.ly/48FO1s - Jesse Stay

Messina additional on IIW http://www.thesocialweb.tv/blog... - Steve Gillmor

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