GIllmor Gang, recording live today 5pm PT participate at http://www.ustream.tv/gillmor...
Here
- Keith Teare
Here
- Kevin Marks
ok will bring up soon. standby
- Tina Chase Gillmor
was just about to leave my desk ... hmmm ...maybe stay and multi-task.
- Laura Norvig
keith you there?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
framer you are next... I have kevin and Keith online
- Tina Chase Gillmor
farber NOT framer
- Tina Chase Gillmor
anybody else in chat?
- Chris Hale
tweet someone. that will help. not our regular time
- Tina Chase Gillmor
waiting on the Scoble
- Tina Chase Gillmor
is THE SCOBLE here yet?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Scobbie, Scobbie
- Tina Chase Gillmor
this sums it up: https://twitter.com/yayitsr...
- Kevin Marks
got mixed feelings about the whole experiment thing
- Chris Hale
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Sandberg
- Kevin Marks
rofl
- Chris Hale
here's the show link ustream.tv/GillmorGang
- Tina Chase Gillmor
I think this whole thing kicks over a hornets nest of what if's. To me its a demonstration of power that a corporation has
- Chris Hale
what do they have to disclose legally?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
I am not really all that bothered by it, its more the principle of the thing
- Chris Hale
that is a weird screech Im hearing
- Tina Chase Gillmor
feels like a slippery slope. what if one day they decided to only show posts of people who are suicidal and see if anybody else actually commits suicide.
- Laura Norvig
Say what you do, and do what you say.
- Ann Greenberg
Johannes Ernst wrote a great post about Facebook's power over our friends to connect to us. Sure, startups experiment all the time. First of all, there are rules over human subjects in scientific testing, which Facebook didn't follow. Secondly, whether true or not, the expectation for most people is that Facebook is a means of communication, not an edited publication.
- Ben Werdmuller
yeah, its like that whole thing a while back when youtube decided not to take some video down that angered muslims. Even after the US govt asked them nicely to take it down they didnt.
- Chris Hale
weird screeches may be crows on telegraph poles here
- Kevin Marks
i see both these types of events as demonstrations of what what type of power corporations have that is outside of govt control
- Chris Hale
experiments is probably not the right word
- Tina Chase Gillmor
There's a huge difference between Fox News - a media company - manipulating the emotions of the viewer. Facebook presents itself as a two-way conduit between people.
- Ben Werdmuller
involuntary probing?
- Chris Hale
experiments is what we call it
- Kevin Marks
I agree with Dan.
- Ann Greenberg
A/B testing
- Kevin Marks
Even on websites marketers are doing A/B testing and people don't know that they're seeing a different version of the page than their neighbor.
- Josh Bradshaw
you know https://www.optimizely.com ?
- Kevin Marks
I think it's pretty awesome that we can get our mind altered without all of the previous side-effects we experienced in the 60's
- Charlie Isaacs
I don't think it's just profiling - thought of it as genuine research to see to what extent the service influences us.
- Laura Norvig
Profiling us, but they need to make that very clear. I do not think that is clear to average users. The issue is the algorithm applied unequally.
- Ann Greenberg
well a/b testing is totally fine but i think given the fact that facebook is a very unique platform that can spark real actions in real life the ramifications for facebook doing a/b tests could have more real costs and implications than maybe a lot of other companies
- Chris Hale
So let's ask, what if you only showed Democrats other Democrat's views? Without telling them...
- Ann Greenberg
I'm not hearing robert
- Kevin Marks
Robert Scoble, I almost think this topic dovetails nicely with that whole thing with "forget me" in google. That has other ramifications like Google being forced delete facts about people who have requested to be forgotten. It all has to do with corporations power over our perception of truth and reality
- Chris Hale
I have no audio
- Kevin Marks
I'm not that concerned personally. And at a rational level, disclosure would kill the ability to do the experiment because users who know would behave differently
- Keith Teare
But Robert, monitoring is different than manipulating
- Ann Greenberg
Ill call you back
- Tina Chase Gillmor
kevin
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Sentiment analysis is different than causing sentiment
- Ann Greenberg
This whole topic is really interesting to me because I had an awesome idea for a movie based on this topic
- Chris Hale
No because they are manipulating what you are being exposed to
- Ann Greenberg
I have no sound at all on the computer I may need to reboout
- Kevin Marks
Ann - the who news stream is filtered for you anyway
- Keith Teare
whole
- Keith Teare
Keith T. I agree with what you are saying, its definitely one reason i don't bother with watching the news
- Chris Hale
Kevin I will call you back when i think reboot time is over
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Is a filtered news stream where you don't control the algorithm more intrinsically desirable than one you curate yourself?
- Ben Werdmuller
On Facebook they give uses an ability to filter by time or popularity. That's what a user thinks are their choice on the filter. If its something else, there isn't a notice and that's what's disturbing (average) users.
- Ann Greenberg
weird, skype crashed the sound driver
- Kevin Marks
kevin can you hear now?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
I think skype was updating itself and ate the sound
- Kevin Marks
Are we going to see lawsuits for situations where folks with more negative feeds went too negative and committed crimes or suicide or experienced emotional damages?
- Josh Bradshaw
I can hear now
- Kevin Marks
we had some issues with it today with G3 gals before the show started
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Interesting - does curating the feed affect who's responsible for its content?
- Ben Werdmuller
Okay, so then there is a progressive algoritm that gets to know you better, but that's different than saying okay, let's now adjust the algorithm based on specific sentiments. Goebbles did this too in essence when he (literally) locked Germans inside the movie theater and forced them to watch the newsreels.
- Ann Greenberg
So, does a machine have a POV?
- Ann Greenberg
Ann: Facebook has a POV: make you use it more. :-)
- Robert Scoble
creative differences?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
crows! ha, ha
- Tina Chase Gillmor
there is debate about that ben
- Kevin Marks
size again
- Tina Chase Gillmor
people modified their grammar too, I'm hearing "Where you AT?" more and more often
- Charlie Isaacs
wow I like this late Thursday rhythm
- Tina Chase Gillmor
me too +Tina, lot's of energy here
- Charlie Isaacs
i really quit using twitter a long time ago
- Chris Hale
Kevin - right, it's now a tough sell to say that they're not aware of the content, eg under the DMCA Safe Harbor rules.
- Ben Werdmuller
It makes sense for more popular people who have followers
- Chris Hale
Charlie... Im surprised. And I liked G3 earlier today too
- Tina Chase Gillmor
twitter just seems so much better when the users lead it's development organically.
- Laura Norvig
We talked about this on G3 a few weeks ago. interesting
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Scoble is showing us the coolaid
- Tina Chase Gillmor
koolaid sounds actually pretty good right now
- Chris Hale
Whatever happened to Twitter metadata?
- Ben Werdmuller
Chris... yeah
- Tina Chase Gillmor
they killed it after they saw our demos at Chirp
- Kevin Marks
Not often.
- Robert Scoble
so you have to be talking to yourself ...
- Laura Norvig
maybe spiked
- Tina Chase Gillmor
if you want to send metatdata through twitter now, use an image
- Kevin Marks
Like Dave Winer is lately, for example
- Ben Werdmuller
is he? He's blocked me (as has pmarca)
- Kevin Marks
He is. Big photos with text in front of them.
- Ben Werdmuller
oh, right. yes missing the point a little
- Kevin Marks
Marc Andreessen unfollowed me
- Kevin Marks
Because of live-tweeting? That would be ironic
- Ben Werdmuller
no, because I called him out about VCs not funding women
- Kevin Marks
Ugh. That's a conversation to engage in, not block yourself away from. Sorry.
- Ben Werdmuller
Kevin... you took the heat on that one but way to go, man!
- Tina Chase Gillmor
linkedin to me is just a live resume for me
- Chris Hale
The "new thing" is that you can get invited to publish on LinkedIn now: https://www.linkedin.com/today...
- Charlie Isaacs
Cool Kevin
- Ann Greenberg
https://www.facebook.com/lists... Technews Facebook.
- Robert Scoble
Scoble, remember to breath
- Chris Hale
https://www.facebook.com/lists... List of 2,800 startups on Facebook.
- Robert Scoble
breathe. Sorry for typo
- Chris Hale
I've never gotten into LinkedIn
- Tina Chase Gillmor
heh
- Robert Scoble
Twitter and Facebook groups bring me (professional) stuff to read. A little bit LinkedIn groups too now. I used to find stuff on Scoop.it too but haven't been on it much. RebelMouse similar.
- Laura Norvig
Cool Keith
- Ann Greenberg
IFTTT is really cool
- Chris Hale
If This Then That. Almost like yahoo pipes
- Laura Norvig
Friendfeed is a dinosaur. But it's Our dinosaur... for now
- Tina Chase Gillmor
Zapier is also cool if you need bigger scale
- Chris Hale
I am using that Friendfeed thing where you click the permalink twice and get a smaller chat window. Love. It.
- Laura Norvig
Both IFTTT and Zapier are awesome and they're adding more and more channels. They are both going to be huge. I'm using them to rapidly prototype IoT for enterprise companies.
- Charlie Isaacs
Chris, have been wondering what Zapier is. It's offered integrated with our Hubspot instance but haven't had a chance to use it.
- Laura Norvig
my big problem right now for IFTTT is that I'd like to purchase the ability to set the frequency that it checks and does certain services
- Chris Hale
and it really makes me mad they don't offer this , id pay for it if they did
- Chris Hale
Ann - thank you. Started it years ago and only ever used it for myself
- Keith Teare
Zapier is basically a platform that allows you to mash up different services
- Chris Hale
you probably should use Heroku for that +Chris :)
- Charlie Isaacs
Thanks for the shout out steve!
- Chris Hale
it defaults to 15 minutes on IFTTT
- Chris Hale
and for realistic home automation or other things 15 minutes is super lame
- Chris Hale
everything he's shot? Pigeons?
- Kevin Marks
stop oking!
- Tina Chase Gillmor
poking
- Tina Chase Gillmor
I was hoping that Thinkup would put more emphasis on content archiving, search and interconnection.
- Darius Dunlap
IFTTT is POV
- Ann Greenberg
Zapier is a great poor mans ETL tool.
- Chris Hale
How about the ruling on Aereo? I was really dissapointed on that ruling
- Chris Hale
They had a pretty decent party at SXSW and i stood by the business model they were building
- Chris Hale
+Scoble is singing "Every breath I take, every move I make you can be watching me" #Police
- Charlie Isaacs
Every single day
Every word I say
Every game I play
Every night I stay
You'll be watching me
- Charlie Isaacs
do you guys believe ala carte pricing will ever happen?
- Chris Hale
I'm singing the boomtown rats "there's always someone looking at you"
- Kevin Marks
Sting "I'll be watching you:" http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Robert Scoble
guys and gals. Sorry didnt mean to forget the ladies in the room
- Chris Hale
TV Everywhere means you need to have transparency when it comes to algorithms like Facebook's
- Ann Greenberg
It's the problem Noam Chomsky described in "Manufacturing Consent".
- Darius Dunlap
Speaking of crap, no more YO for Scoble
- Josh Bradshaw
Product fail since Kevin called his watch cute
- Chris Hale
I am waiting for Moto 360 watch
- Chris Hale
still a little dissapointed that these watches are co-dependent on being attached to a phone
- Chris Hale
I'll be *watching* you. Through your watch.
- Laura Norvig
have you seen woz's watch? he's got a vacuum tube watch, every other watch is a piece of crap. When I saw him last I caught it on video: https://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Charlie Isaacs
I just got my Pebble, I kinda like it. I can manage my business from my watch :)
- Charlie Isaacs
Chris - you are right - and divorced from carriers too, messaging over WiFi is big: http://www.northforkvue.com/world...
- Ann Greenberg
I dont completely agree, I think its ability to augment the phone experience is pretty important.
- Chris Hale
i think having a device that can help save my phones battery is a worthwhile device
- Chris Hale
Carrier agnostic please
- Ann Greenberg
a device that can help me get in/out/ and on with life quickly for notifications is a valuable tool
- Chris Hale
The term watch is the only way to define a new class of tool that we are guessing at.
- Arnie Klaus
I envision a future that these watches become fitness trackers and other things like a device for 2factor authentication
- Chris Hale
he means ring.ly
- Kevin Marks
finger is a target, look up nod and fin
- Chris Hale
The "watch" is the wrong metaphor, just like calling it a "phone" is the wrong metaphor.
- Darius Dunlap
yes, darius
- Kevin Marks
but wristscreen is not great
- Kevin Marks
Where does the implant go? Earings?
- Arnie Klaus
these are devices i am following closely
- Chris Hale
wow, now I get to learn new hand gestures on GG, awesome :)
- Charlie Isaacs
they bring us one step closer to minority report type controls
- Chris Hale
the other device i am really interested in is https://www.thalmic.com/en...
- Chris Hale
the myo armband. That thing is super cool
- Chris Hale
Lukaku did it
- Tom Guarriello
YaYY
- Ben Werdmuller
YxYY!!! me too
- Ann Greenberg
I agree +Chris
- Charlie Isaacs
YaYY sounds like a Yo variant
- Kevin Marks
thanks everyone :) nice show!
- Charlie Isaacs
name for show?
- Tina Chase Gillmor
No YOs.
- Robert Scoble
we're being watched
- Kevin Marks
when will July 3 show go "on demand" ?
- charles carrico